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old head expression more useful than new?

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schwarzgrau
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Nov 15, 2019 8:56 am

old head expression more useful than new?

Post by schwarzgrau » Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:04 pm

Maybe it's just me, but since a few version DUIK uses this expression for the position of S | HEAD

Code: Select all

//Duik.autorig.head
var ctrlLayer = thisComp.layer("C | Head");
var result = ctrlLayer.toWorld( ctrlLayer.anchorPoint );
if ( hasParent ) result = parent.fromWorld(result);
result;
I guess this has some advantages (even if I don't know which) to the old expression, which thankfully still work

Code: Select all

thisComp.layer("C | Head").transform.position - thisComp.layer("C | Head").transform.anchorPoint
With the "new" expression the head doesn't move along if you move the hips or the chest and so seems a bit less responsive, so I asked myself why it was changed.

User avatar
Duduf
Posts: 813
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 2:59 pm

Re: old head expression more useful than new?

Post by Duduf » Wed Apr 01, 2020 3:08 pm

The previous expression broke if you added a "zero" to the head controller, so I had to change it.

It may have a (very) little impact on the performance, BUT it should not change at all the way the controller/the whole rig works. If it changed that may be a bug, or maybe the head controller which is not parented correctly.

Anyway, I'm going to re-think a little bit the way the rig works for the shoulders/neck/head part because it seems it confuses some people. I think it can be improved!

schwarzgrau
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Nov 15, 2019 8:56 am

Re: old head expression more useful than new?

Post by schwarzgrau » Wed Apr 01, 2020 3:39 pm

Ah ok, I never used a zero on it. But weird that the new expression should work exactly like the old one. I tried it several times on different rigs and always noticed that the head stays still when I move the shoulders, hips or the body, which isn't the case with the old expression. By the way it's the same behaviour if I use the human auto-rig or do it by hand.

But yea, it is a little bit confusing at first, but in the end it's pretty easy to use.

User avatar
Duduf
Posts: 813
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 2:59 pm

Re: old head expression more useful than new?

Post by Duduf » Wed Apr 01, 2020 4:12 pm

Hum... It's really time I have a closer look at that ;)

Thanks for the feedback !

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SandyBD
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2016 2:56 pm

Re: old head expression more useful than new?

Post by SandyBD » Sun Apr 19, 2020 3:01 pm

I am having the same experience, the head/shoulders move very differently than in previous versions. When I drag the hips down, the head/neck/shoulders do not move with legs and torso.

Personally, I prefer the older versions, but that may just be out of habit. I will try using the newer version for a few days and see how it goes.

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Duduf
Posts: 813
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 2:59 pm

Re: old head expression more useful than new?

Post by Duduf » Sun Apr 19, 2020 4:05 pm

The hips move just the hips, the body ctrl will bring the head too. That's always been the case in Duik, the only thing which changed are some names.

What version are you talking about when you say "the older versions"?

yves
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2020 1:55 pm

Re: old head expression more useful than new?

Post by yves » Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:04 pm

I have the same thing with the hips.

In the Goyle rig when I move the hips the head follows.
In the last version (v16.2.9) when I move the hips the head doesn't move.

I'm still learning so maybe this is normal ;)
Attachments
Goyle.jpg
Goyle.jpg (681.14 KiB) Viewed 1493 times
New.jpg
New.jpg (444.82 KiB) Viewed 1493 times

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Duduf
Posts: 813
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 2:59 pm

Re: old head expression more useful than new?

Post by Duduf » Thu May 14, 2020 8:17 am

When you move the hips the head should not follow, that's an improvement/fix

As I said: The hips move just the hips, the body controller will move the head and the whole torso too.

The hips controller is there to animate the hips and just the hips.

schwarzgrau
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Nov 15, 2019 8:56 am

Re: old head expression more useful than new?

Post by schwarzgrau » Thu May 14, 2020 9:22 am

Ah maybe there is the "problem". Some people like me prefer it that the head follows if the hips move too far and some people (including you) prefer it if the head stays in place even if the hips move completely away

User avatar
Duduf
Posts: 813
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 2:59 pm

Re: old head expression more useful than new?

Post by Duduf » Thu May 14, 2020 1:21 pm

Well, when you're animating, you should never pull anything this far away; From my experience as a 3D animator, you never want the head or any limb to move when you pull some other part of the rig, you want to animate/control each part by yourslf; otherwise you won't know anymore what's moving what, and you end up with keyframes on the head to compensate some movement on the hips, and then you're not able anymore to adjust your animation, it's too complicated.
If the head has to move, it's better to just keyframe it. In other words: one limb = one controller.
This is the issue with knees for example: with IK it's a pain to precisely control the knees because they're influenced both by the hips and the foot controller, and you often end up with unwanted bumps or poor control over their trajectory and it's technically very difficult to control... (This is the reason why any experienced animator will try to use FK instead of IK most of the time: on the legs when the feet are not visible, and all the time on the arms)

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